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The Path To Leadership
We podcast about strong leaders, loyal employees, avoiding burnout, and raising profits building strong cultures. Everyone is a leader, but the path isn't always easy. Developing critical skills to build stronger, more successful and profitable organizations.
The Path To Leadership
Building Communities Through Economic Vision with Jason Smith
Leadership isn't about following a straight line—it's about navigating unexpected turns while keeping your vision clear. Jason Smith, President and CEO of the Manhattan Area Chamber of Commerce, exemplifies this journey, having transformed from an aspiring sports journalist to an economic development leader guiding communities across multiple states.
During our conversation, Jason reveals how university communities uniquely shaped his leadership style. "When you live in university cities, you have to be very thoughtful about explaining all elements of projects and be ready to face criticism because it's coming," he explains. This environment forces leaders to develop deeper empathy and more thorough preparation—skills that serve any leader well regardless of setting.
Whether you're building community initiatives, guiding economic development, or navigating your own career path, Jason's insights provide practical wisdom for becoming a more thoughtful, patient, and effective leader. Listen now to discover how developing these qualities can transform both your leadership approach and the communities you serve.
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to the path to leadership. I'm excited I have another one of my favorite classmates from Leadership Kansas. Hey, Jason, how are you?
Jason Smith:I am doing great, katie, how are you?
Dr. Katie:Well, in full transparency, we're recording this on a Monday and it feels like it's the Monday-est Monday of all Mondays.
Jason Smith:Yeah, I'm feeling it. It is. Every technology thing hates me today and I'm not sure exactly what's going on, but fortunately I'm here. Fortunately we were able to connect.
Dr. Katie:That's right. We're together and so far recording and everything's working. So that's a good thing and I'm not just a classmate, I am your bus buddy. That's right, I was going to say not just any classmate, my bus buddy, which means we were responsible for each other to make sure we didn't miss the bus.
Jason Smith:That had to be the easiest job for both of us, because you and I are both early there people, and so that was literally we were the easiest bus buddies, probably of any of the two that were matched up.
Dr. Katie:I know, I know, and it's funny, because when they say you got bus buddies, you're like what does that mean? It feels like it's very like second grade and we're like, oh okay, just make sure they're here, and so we would just eye contact and move on.
Jason Smith:Yeah, you are in my phone still as Katie bus buddy.
Dr. Katie:I love it. Well, and the best part is, I mean, you're in one of my favorite places in Kansas, you're in Manhattan.
Jason Smith:I am yeah, yeah, and I love it here, so it's great You're in Manhattan. I am yeah, yeah, and I love it here, so it's great.
Dr. Katie:Yeah Well, and I just keep finding excuses to get up there. Every time I've been up there, you haven't been there, so we got to coordinate schedules.
Jason Smith:We haven't figured out how to connect. We actually connected in Hays, ironically, but yeah, so one of these days maybe we can catch a time where I'm here and you're in town.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, that would be great. Well, before we go too deep into all of our experience and everything, can you introduce yourself to everyone, who you are, what you do, all that good stuff? Sure.
Jason Smith:So my name is Jason Smith and my official title is President CEO Although you know, usually when I introduce myself I just say I'm with because we're a big team here but President and CEO of the Manhattan Area Chamber of Commerce in Manhattan, kansas.
Dr. Katie:I love it. Well, and can you? I know you've had such a cool career journey and that was one of the fun things about being bus buddies is we became the first friends in class because we got to interview each other. So can you tell everyone a little bit about your career journey?
Jason Smith:Yeah, it's pretty varied. So I started my career as a journalist and I didn't realize in the late 80s when I went to college that journalism was not a growing field of the future, although there have been some opportunities. It's been kind of interesting to watch how that's changed. But I was a sports writer and my goal at that point was I was going to be the next great Sports Illustrated columnist Figured out early on. That wasn't going to happen and the newspaper industry is tough. It's when you have a family because there's so much nights and weekends and it's just a really weird dynamic and quite frankly at that time and I don't think it's changed a lot it's hard to raise a family on what they pay journalists to. So I had the opportunity, because of some contacts I'd made and friendships I'd built, to lead the economic development organization in the town where I was working at the newspaper, which is in Calistro, oklahoma, and in hindsight it was kind of a crazy decision on their part. That worked out, I think, for everybody, but didn't know anything about economic development. But at the time the organization was was not struggling to maintain its credibility, particularly with the city what they call city council there, we call city commission here. But and so they really want somebody. They trusted in that, in that role and and so I was given that opportunity and I have, and I thought at the time that I transition that into city manager or something along those lines. But I just loved it and found out that it was a lot more enjoyable, maybe than being a city manager, and so I have had. I've been in four different, five different communities.
Jason Smith:So I left Macalester and went to Lincoln, nebraska, where I ran the economic development section of the chamber in Lincoln for about 10 years, then became chamber president in Abilene, texas, which was great and loved it down there. But I got the opportunity to take the economic development job in my hometown, which is what I thought would be my dream job and my retirement job. There were a lot of changes at the top, from the university and the city and some other things, and it just got, quite frankly, really messy and hard and I either had to be satisfied with going to work every day and just keeping the doors open, which is just not something that I can do. And so I got a call from a headhunter about the Manhattan job and I didn't really know a lot about Manhattan other than you know the old Big 8 football days and Big 12 and had never been to Manhattan. And they said you really got to go check it out.
Jason Smith:And from the first time I got here I was super impressed with the vibrancy in the community and that it was a lot larger. I always say Manhattan's greater than Google says it is, because until you really are here it's hard to get a good feel for what the town's about. And fell in love with the town and the people that ran, that were the volunteer leadership of the chamber and got the opportunity to take this job. And I just passed my sixth anniversary.
Dr. Katie:That's cool. Yeah, it's funny because people have no idea you know what Manhattan Kansas really is until you really go. And I think that's a cool part about Leadership Kansas is, you know, we travel around the state and I've talked about this with a bunch of our classmates. You know we just get to see all kinds of different places, and even places that you live or you've been to. You get to see different sides of them. So what was some of your biggest takeaways from the experience in Leadership Kansas?
Jason Smith:Yeah, so part of the reason why I decided to apply was that I moved here in 2019. And you know, you get here, you get your feet kind of get your feet on the ground at your own job. And where I'd been before is the fourth state I've been in. That was when I got a chance to get out in the state, meet people and see things and really get a feel for what the state was like. Well, if you remember, a year after I took this job, we went on lockdown and didn't do anything, and then we have transitioned so much of what we do in terms of like right now I'm the chair of the Kansas Chamber Execs and we have one in-person meeting. Everything else is Zoom right, and historically, when I've been part of these groups, we've got to travel and see other parts of the state. So I really wanted the opportunity to learn more about what Kansas was about, particularly economically right. That's kind of my passion about communities and states and trying to figure out what makes them tick, and so that was really what I got out of it.
Jason Smith:I was so impressed probably more with the places that I least expected, like Dodge City and Pittsburgh. Right, those those probably were two of my favorite places to visit and if you'd have told me before the year that would be the result of that, I would have, I would have probably been skeptical. But every place has something and you know you, always every time we went somewhere it was like there's, here's, this big project we're working on. So Dodge City is doing, you know, of course, they had the Hill Marquis plant, but they're also planning massive downtown redevelopment. And Garden City had their Starbond district with all the the recreation and those kinds of things and you went to, you know, kansas City was legends and Pittsburgh had their downtown, which was incredible, and they're moving their business college downtown.
Jason Smith:I mean just, it was everywhere you went. There was a massive Wichita had their park there, you know, beside the Children's Museum. That just was super impressive and it's just. I mean it just says a lot about, I think, who we are as a state that there's so many great things going on and we get really wrapped up in our own deals and forget that. The other thing that I think was helpful for me and I don't know if it's this way for everybody you know we're in the trenches on a day-to-day basis here in Manhattan fighting for things, and sometimes you get a little. You don't appreciate all the things you have, and so it was really great when all you came to Manhattan and commented on oh, this is great, and this is great, and you can kind of look back and go yeah, you know what? We do have a lot of really cool things here too, and so that was that was a good reminder for me as well.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, yeah, I love that and it's true, because we think, oh, this is ho-hum, we do this all the time and it's like, oh no, like there's some really cool things in our community that we don't get to see it because we're not here as tourists or visitors, where we just see them all the time.
Jason Smith:Yeah, and particularly you know the things around the university and a lot of things that are going on and all the downtown redevelopment because I came after that was already pretty much done and so a lot of people who hadn't been to Manhattan before and they see downtown and all the things that are going on, they're just man. This is so different than it was and it's just a good reminder to me that Manhattan's a great place, which I know it is. But, like you said, when you're in the fight every day, trying to make it better and trying to maintain the quality of life for all of our residents, and sometimes you forget that you know how lucky that we really are.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, and you mentioned the Kansas Chamber executives and I was introduced to the group because Sarah from our class is also a member of the group and I was so fortunate to speak at your guys' conference last year. But when you mentioned that it made me think like I love working with local Chamber of Commerce because you really have the pulse on so much. So you know, can you kind of talk about your thoughts on Chambers and how people should engage and understand the work they do?
Jason Smith:Yeah, I mean it's always unique.
Jason Smith:We do three new member orientations a month and the thing that I always say, kind of to lead it off, is if you've seen one chamber, you've seen one chamber, because chambers, because of their independence and they're all operated separately, they reflect the values of the community and their members, which is what they should right.
Jason Smith:So it's tough to sort of blanket statement across the board on it, but as a general rule, you know the chambers and communities are where a lot of the work is done around community growth, quality of life. You know economic prosperity, all the things that make your community sustainable and make it a great place to live and I have you know, depending on all the different activities, that that chamber may undertake, as a general rule, we used to say when we were in Lincoln and not all chambers are like this either but we're pro-growth, not anti-tax, right, we want to make this community a better place and we're willing to do the work necessary to make it a better place. And I find most chambers are particularly local, chambers are set up that way, and so if you really are looking to make a difference long term in your community, I can't think of a better place generally than getting involved in your local chamber place generally than getting involved in your local chamber.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, yeah, I agree, and it's unique here in Kansas City area because we have all of our little communities with chambers and then we have the greater Casey Chamber and it is interesting to see how the difference, even just local Kansas City Chambers, reflect kind of what their little communities' priorities are, and so while they're, like you said, all doing kind of similar work, some of it is very drastically different, reflecting their kind of community and population.
Jason Smith:Oh for sure. In fact, when we were there for Leadership Kansas and we had a chance to hear the KCK presentation, it was interesting the dynamics of that organization and where they are and what they work on compared to us or compared to Olathe or compared to Overland Park, and so yeah, it is a lot different even on the Kansas side. So then you throw in the Missouri chambers in that too. And the other thing that's unique about Kansas City is the KCADC, which is the Kansas Area Development Corp, is such an effective. Kcadc, which is a Kansas City Area Development Corp, is such an effective large organization that you know it takes a lot of the worry of that out of the local chambers and they're able to rely on that larger entity to really drive a lot of the economic development in the region really, and so you know what Tim and those folks do there at KCADC is pretty remarkable.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, that's so interesting. I never thought about that. I love Tim and then also Steve and Anthony at the KCEDC, so we have the EDC and ADC, but yeah, they do such remarkable work and I never thought about that tie with the chambers here, so that is a unique perspective.
Jason Smith:Yeah, because we do so. We do economic development for the chamber here and it's pretty time consuming and is a lot of work and you know if you had that umbrella entity that does. And then Casey has a wonderful tourism organization too and so we have tourism here at the chamber and so that's where you see a lot of that differs when you start getting into more of the larger cities. But but yeah, I think I think what's? I think what most of what Kansas has in our communities. I've been super impressed with the chamber execs I've met very professional, very committed to their communities and and so I think that's that's a very strong positive for the state.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, yeah, I do too. Well, and just thinking about those different communities and thinking about the different communities that you've been in you've mentioned, you know, Abilene and Lincoln and Norman and now Manhattan how have the different communities kind of shaped you as a leader, you know? Have you noticed your growth along the way?
Jason Smith:Yeah, I mean, obviously the easy answer is and I tell people this all the time I'm clearly a university city guy, right, because I've been Lincoln, norman and Manhattan. Somebody asked me one time if I was going to tour the whole Big Eight and I said I will not live in Lawrence and I will not live in Stillwater, so that will not happen. But I'm just teasing. Those are all great places, you know, when you live in university cities, I think it makes you stronger in terms of having to. When you, when you're dealing with initiatives and projects, you have to be very thoughtful about explaining all elements of it and be ready to face the criticism because it's coming right.
Jason Smith:Somebody told me one time that part of the reason that it's so hard to do things like this in university cities is that the university culture is to question everything right, and so as chamber execs, you have to, or economic development executives which is kind of where I came out of you have to be prepared that you're going to get questioned like your dissertation and that you're going to be under the gun, and you better be prepared to answer all the reasons why and all the reasons why not. And so I think that's made me better. I think I'm a lot more thoughtful about trying to understand where people who maybe are opposed to different initiatives or projects where they're coming from, so that you can address those concerns early on in that process. And whereas I've seen some of my counterparts who work who have worked historically in more pro-business, you know kind of business-led communities.
Jason Smith:They just can't grasp that right. It's just like, well, no, this is the way you do it and you have to do it this way and I go, it is, I'm with you, but, but it's okay to sit down and have a dialogue about you know the various ways that you can do things and why you do those things. So I think, more than anything else, it's just made me be more thoughtful, empathetic and made me be a lot more prepared when big projects come up. Abilene was the one exception to that. West Texas. You get out that part of the country and people just are. They just have to be just based on the history of that region. It's just we're going to do it, let's just do it and um, so you get a lot more of the um. You get a lot less of the debate over things and more uh, you know, let's go out and do these things, but uh and I learned a lot out there too, but um, but that's sort of been where it is.
Jason Smith:It's just the university function and what that's meant as part of that whole process.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, well, and that's such an interesting tie I had not thought about, but it is funny. I take such great pride in being a Pittsburgh State Gorilla and to be in a K-State Wildcat. And when people go to Pittsburgh for the first time and they're like the trash cans are the school colors and there's gorillas in everybody's yards and in all the businesses. And our classmate Kim you know the work she does down there it's like, yeah, when the university and community thrive together, the businesses also, you know, get that buy-in and can thrive as well. I think.
Jason Smith:Yeah, but I think Pittsburgh's unique right I mean, look, I'm a regional college guy. I went to Cameron University in Lawton, oklahoma, and I've been in towns like Ada and you go to Hayes and you go to Kearney and you go to all these other towns that have regional colleges and you don't see the connection between the community and university like you see in Pittsburgh I think that's a that is a unique situation down there that that they need. They need to definitely protect and and and keep it strong, because that's pretty awesome.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, it's so special and it's funny. Now my daughter's down there and living her best life and my son's friends all just graduated from college and they went to Northwest Missouri which boo, why would you do that? And then they go down to football games with us to see my daughter and they're like why didn't I come down here? And I'm like boys, I told you it's just night and day different, based on the communities.
Jason Smith:Yeah, there's parts in it's Northwest based on the communities. Yeah, there's parts it's Northwest Missouri's in St Joe, right I?
Dr. Katie:mean there's parts it's in Maryville.
Jason Smith:Oh, Maryville yeah.
Dr. Katie:But yes, Missouri Western in St Joe Kind.
Jason Smith:Of the same thing, yeah, I mean you go to St Joe. I mean St Joe's a fine community, but it's hard to tell that there's a university there and that I mean they typically have been like great in football, right, and so it's just. I just think Pittsburgh's unique and I enjoy getting to spend the two or three days we got to spend down there and kind of see that in action.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, it's a fun time. Well, in thinking about kind of your leadership journey and I've talked to some of our classmates is there someone that kind of taught you or mentored you throughout your journey that's made a lasting impression on you?
Jason Smith:Yeah, you know, when we talked about kind of the themes that we were talking about, I'm kind of fall back on my chamber answer, but one of the things that has been that I find to be super interesting in this job sometimes I say interesting because sometimes not great but not bad either is I have a new boss every year. I have a new chair every year and that's who we look at. We have an exec committee of five people and they rotate up through the chairs. So I mean eventually you build a relationship with this person over their first three years and then they're in your chair, but so I literally have to change, kind of how we do things, at least in terms of interaction with the board, on an annual basis, and so I think that by itself has taught me a lot in terms of flexibility.
Jason Smith:I mean, I could go back and talk about I've had some great chairs. One that really comes to mind, joanne Martin, who was the chairman and CEO of Emeritus Life Insurance in Lincoln, and one time she was on the Federal Reserve Board in Kansas City and top 10 females in life insurance I mean just one of the smartest people I've ever met, and she was our chair for a couple of years when I was in Lincoln and we would go sit down once a month with her and it was like a clinic. Every time I'd go in there on something, and you know, but I had. I've had other, you know, jim Krieger, who was the CFO at Gallup, and I got the one one of the founders of a accounting firm in Abilene, texas, and I've just, I've just been really fortunate that I have got to work with a lot of people that I've been able to take a lot of good and bad from and apply it to myself.
Jason Smith:And from a personal standpoint, I think probably the most influential person in my life was my grandfather who unfortunately passed away when I was in my young, my early 20s. But you know my parents were divorced and we spent a lot. I spent a lot of time with my grandpa. You know most of my, most of my life skills. I try to emulate him. He's just very. He was very family oriented, very compassionate and, you know, kind of led with, led with love and and so I do my. I fall way short most of the time, but just from an individual standpoint I do my best to try to emulate him.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, that is so, so fantastic. And yeah, when you talk about your grandpa, it made me think of mine and it's like my grandpa Floyd. It's who you want to be on your best day and who you're fighting to be on on the days that you're not showing up your best. So yeah.
Jason Smith:So my grandpa was an interesting guy. He um, he went to. He was the first person in his family that went to college and, ironically, to Abilene Christian. So he he had. He lived in Abilene, texas way before I did, but when the Dust Bowl hit and the Depression hit and his dad passed away, he went back home and worked on the farm and then he and his brothers opened a farm implant dealership and sold Minneapolis Moline tractors.
Jason Smith:I always said if they'd have picked John Deere I would have been set for life. But no, they picked Minneapolis Moline. But anyway, that's a different story. But when his kids graduated from high school, they went to college at Oklahoma Christian, and he said you know what? I'm going to go finish college and he and his wife who maybe I should say my grandmother because my grandmother was a saint, maybe I should say my grandmother because my grandmother was a saint but they picked up and left their business behind and became dorm parents at Oklahoma Christian, and he finished school and then became dean of men there for a while before he ended up going back and finishing his career at the dealership. But he just decided that was what he was going to do. Just knowledge and education meant a lot to him and he gave it all up to pursue that and got his master's degree and he was just a real interesting guy and I always appreciated the few years I got with him and how much I learned from him over that time.
Dr. Katie:Wow, Wow. And how unique for him to say you know what? There's a chapter that's not finished and I'm going to go back and and finish that, that chapter.
Jason Smith:Yeah.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, well, and it makes me think you know about people's motivation and and work, and how we work and what we do, and and so, thinking about all the work that you've done over the years, what keeps you motivated and excited about the work you're doing?
Jason Smith:Yeah, I mean, I think, at the end of the day, it's the things that we do actually help people directly. And this is a story I've told a lot over the years, but it's what has kept me, I think, doing this business, Because there's a lot of days when you shake your head and go. Why do I do this again?
Jason Smith:Because you know, it's a lot of work for you know you get a lot of criticism and scrutiny and those kind of things, which is fine. But when I was in Macalester still we were we had landed a pretty substantial manufacturer there at the time. A pretty substantial manufacturer there at the time. It called Simonton Windows. And then about a year later we were trying to get a sales tax passed to support economic development efforts, which is pretty common among communities. We have it here and some other places, and so we had the guy who was running Simonton Windows had previously worked at another factory that ironically or coincidentally closed about the same time that Simonton announced they were coming.
Jason Smith:So a lot of the employees were immediately able just to transition over and we said, hey, we really need a quote from one of those folks for our marketing materials about the impact of economic development has had on their lives. And you know just the fact that you were able to go from one job to the other job. He goes oh, I've got a couple of people, let me, let me track them down. And so the newspaper interviewed one of them and I was reading it in the paper the next day and it was a lady and she was talking about that situation and she said she got her notice that the plant was closing, and and she said, um, I just sat in my car and cried and and I thought for that for a minute, it's like wow. And then she said, you know, a week later I found out this other plant was opening and I got a job, and and all and, and her exact words were and now we can have christmas, um, and so you think about that and you, you know it's, it's the work we do impacts people's lives on a very personal level and and, um, you know, we, you know I always say that we're our.
Jason Smith:Our goal is to maintain and grow people's qualities, quality of life, and that's that's what of life and that's what we do, and that's really the only thing that would keep me. I've had opportunities to go in the private sector, make a lot more money and probably not near as much stress, but the reward isn't the same, and so that's why I've kind of stayed in this realm more of the public realm.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, that makes so much sense. And you know thinking about kind of the cities we visited and everything we saw and thinking about. You know workforce trends. I mean I spend so much time in my days and in trends that are happening with shifting to automation and all that kind of stuff. And so do you see anything when it comes to economic development that you know leaders and I guess it's really community dependent but that we should be thinking about for the future?
Jason Smith:Yeah, I mean, I think onshoring is real. I mean I think there's a lot of things in terms of what's going on, and I don't think it's a short-term deal. I think there's a lot of what's going on that is going to continue. I think, big picture-wise and I've heard this and I'm sure you've heard this in other places is if I and I have my wife and I have eight kids, and I advise all the younger ones, you better get a skill right and preferably something that that's documented Right, so either sort of certification or some kind of some kind of a documentation that you're proficient in something, because it better be something that that that a machine can't do, because those people can write their tickets.
Jason Smith:And you think about electricians, you think about construction workers, you think about health care professionals. There are a number of areas right now that you could go to school. We were doing a project in here one day where we're working on some different workforce initiatives, some different workforce initiatives, and we figured out that you can graduate here with an RN degree, have had your entire school paid for in some form or fashion, regardless of income, regardless of grades, just through a variety of resources available. You could be an RN at 20 years old, making $90,000 without any debt or having paid any tuition, and you know, those kind of opportunities, for whatever reason, are escaping, I think, our young people. You know this is not meant to be derogatory towards any particular individual or group of people. However, I think we as a society should put a little bit more expectations on guidance counselors in public schools than we do now, and I say that everyone in my family is in education, so I've been around education, I'm the first non-educator in my family that went to college, the, and, and. So I think sometimes what you see is that that you get the individuals who are very motivated to to increase their education and improve themselves and they go back to school, they get masters, whatever, and they become counselors, and I think that's great.
Jason Smith:But we ought to have a different segment of people who work with students on careers segment of people who work with students on careers. Yeah, and because I have seen too many times, including members of my own family, yeah, not in manhattan, but in other places that have been given really bad advice or or led, and you know you end up sort of hoping hopefully you can get in there and and um and discuss that with people and and and make them understand where things actually are. But to me, that's the only way we're going to compete as a country. Going forward is aligning our workforce of people to the needs and the economy, and if we can do that, I think we can be incredibly successful as a country. I mean, we'll be successful, but we can be incredibly successful. But if we keep churning out people with degrees that have no future, it's going to be tough, I think.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, yeah, I agree, and I mean it's interesting because I teach workforce skills and I mean there are people that have been in their career for 20, 30 years that I am am teaching and they're like I wish I would have known that when I came out of college or when I came out of high school and, um it, you, you, talking, made me think. My nephew is graduating from college in another state, um, at a very nice regional school, and he's required to have an internship and he's in IT. And he went into the internship office whatever it is career services and he said what do I need? I need an internship for me to graduate, and no hyperbole.
Dr. Katie:The woman said you should call Google because they're always hiring people. And I'm thinking who is this sweet young man who's 21 years old, in the middle of the country just going to call Google and Google's going to answer? And so then he was spinning like what am I going to do? And his mother, who's in education, swooped in and saved the day. But the kids that don't have that, that don't have people in their life that are giving them that path. It's like where do they go?
Jason Smith:So I'll give you a prime example. That happened to me. And so my son, when he was in high school and he went to high school in Oklahoma, he and I walked through this is what I like to do, this is what I'm really good at, this is what my career goals are. And we met I mean, I have the good fortune of knowing a lot of executives and we sat down with a variety of different people and he got to see this is what, and you know, and he was very committed to that One meeting with his guidance counselor who said, well, I guess you just want to sit in a cubicle your whole life, huh, and I'm just, and he goes, dad, I don't want to sit in a cubicle my whole life.
Jason Smith:I go, son, let's. Let's go back. Remember we, we talked to this guy and this woman and this person you know, and I had to get him back to where we were before. Now he's associated with PWC and he's in capital markets and he's putting these deals together. But one word from a guidance counselor almost completely ruined two years of pretty diligent work on that.
Jason Smith:And I am an engaged parent. You've got a lot of people, or not, you know? The other thing is, I hear a lot of people want to own my own business. Well, the best way to own your own business is be an electrician or be a plumber or be you know, not only can you decide how much or little you want to work, but you're going to make. You're going to make a lot of money. Yeah, At least the way the market is and I think is going to make a lot of money. Uh, yeah, at least the way the market is and I think is going to be in the foreseeable future.
Jason Smith:And so you start thinking about trades and it reminds me. It reminds me of the south park episode where the two richest guys in, you know, in the in the country, ended up being the, the maintenance guys. But I mean that's kind of where we're headed is. You know, people who can actually do things are in demand and we have to do a better job of that.
Jason Smith:The other thing from the economic development area that I think we're looking at and still trying to figure out you know, obviously when COVID happened, the office market tanked and I think I heard it's you know they're losing about 5% occupancy nationwide per year and I think the projection is to lose more as more leases come up for renewal. But now there seems to be a movement to go back to work. So I think you know that's going to be an interesting thing to watch. And then retail, and I think we've seen the days of massive retail centers, at least at the volume that they were being built and as people see more logistics and warehousing and those kind of things, moving products from the manufacturer to people's homes and less purchasing at the actual store.
Jason Smith:So those are all things that I think people have to be aware of as they are thinking about their community development strategies.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, it's such an interesting world. I was talking to someone recently and it's like you know, kids these days will never realize the joy of going into Blockbuster or Family Video on, you know, wednesday, when new releases are there and you know all the things Hastings. Remember.
Jason Smith:Hastings, yeah, and when the new? You know you'd wait for your CD to come out. Oh, that was the best.
Dr. Katie:I know A record bar at the mall Back in our day. Yeah, I know that was great our day. I know they will never understand the weight of it all. Well, I could get on the soapbox and preach. I love everything you're talking about.
Jason Smith:You know a lot more about that than I do. I happen to see what happens when the results of that and people say, well, we'd love to come to Manhattan, but where am I going to find you know X number of people that do this particular thing. It's like, well, you know, it's just, it's hard.
Dr. Katie:It is hard, it is such a it's going to be an interesting next three, five, 10 years to see where we end up, Sam Well. And so the final question is everybody on every show? I love to hear these answers because I believe that our career journey is not a straight, clean, clear path. And so, to the level you're comfortable sharing, what's the biggest leadership or career misstep you've taken?
Jason Smith:Yeah, I thought about this too, so I don't know that it's one or two. I would say my biggest, the challenge I've had in my life that that I've had a couple of instances where I where I feel like, um, I wish I could have done that again, uh is is I've just been a little impatient at times and and I and I say that in a couple of ways number one early in my career I would have, we would be working on something, and if everybody wasn't on board, I would get incredibly frustrated and you know I probably would have handled it differently.
Jason Smith:I mean sometimes you just have to say, all right, it doesn't work this time, we'll come at it again later. And there were times I was able to do that, but obviously there were times. But where it really has, I think there's been a job or two, that the end of your rope. And you know, and I'm thrilled I'm thrilled to be in Manhattan where I am now. But there have been instances where I thought lies can't do this anymore with this particular individual. You know be having this much authority, and so you move on. And then you know six months later that person's gone and everything would have been fine. You know, six months later, that person's gone and everything would have been fine.
Jason Smith:And so you know I try to, I try as a. You know my wife always is encouraging me to be more patient with everything, including my kids and grandkids. You know that's probably been the one area. You know I just I want things done and I want it done. Then, and you know that kind of goes against what I said earlier about you know you have to be prepared, but once I'm prepared and have an argument and I'm ready, we should be ready to go.
Jason Smith:Why is this taking so long? And so over the years, I've just kind of convinced myself. You know, it'll come in due time. Just have a little more patience or it won't.
Jason Smith:You know, I had a boss tell me one time always remember, the organization belongs to the members, not to you. And and so I have tried to take that lesson with me and and said, ok, well, if it's not important enough to the overwhelming number of the members to do, then it's clearly not something that they're ready to do right now. And so, you know, I think that that would be the one area that that I have to work on every day. I have to, you know, we we talk about it with our team every day, because it's a very frustrating job and, as I've said before, university communities are very frustrating places to do this very frustrating job, and so we do spend time talking about that and how we can, you know, maintain positive momentum and not let those kind of setbacks you know, to use a golf vernacular, don't let a bad hole turn into three or four bad holes, right.
Dr. Katie:Don't let a bad hole beat you more than once, yeah. Yeah, absolutely, that is good lessons learned so well. I love this conversation but, more importantly, I loved the last 10 months that we got to spend together and so fortunate to get to know you and looking forward to being bus buddies for life.
Jason Smith:That's right. That's right and it's been great. And you know they say all the time that you know you stay connected with people. But you know, I just had lunch the other day with Steve Webb. I just had lunch the other day with Steve Webb and, as I said, we're on the Courtney, who I think has been on your show, saw her. We're on the local planning committee together and it's just great to get to see people and I keep up with everybody's pictures on social media and so it's a lot of fun. I appreciate it. I think. I really do think we probably had one of the better classes. You know I'm not one of those best class ever people, but it was a really good class and there's some really good people and and I'm, I feel, blessed to have gotten to be part of it.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, me too. I mean it's, it's life-changing and it's hard to explain, but it's definitely a wonderful turn in the road that now we have 38 other people going on the road with us.
Jason Smith:That's right.
Dr. Katie:Yeah, awesome. Well, thank you everyone for joining me on the Path to Leadership and I will talk to you next time. Bye, everyone.
